RE: Our Educational Foundation Was Built On Christianity.

Replying to this blog:

“The only foundation for a useful education in a republic is to be laid in religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty”

 Benjamin Rush

 “Secular schools can never be tolerated because such a school has no religious instruction and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith…. We need believing people.”

– Adolf Hitler, Mein Kamf

“Why is it we as Americans think we are fixing something that is not broken, we took religion out of schools thinking it made us more tolerable, that it would give our students a better education, or for whatever reason, saying there is no room for Religion in academic thinking, while forgetting that our very academic foundation was found on Christian Principles.”

No, we took religious indoctrination out of the schools and you can still teach kids about religion, you just cannot preach your religion to everyone else’s kids.  And our academic foundation was in no way built on the intermixing of religion and government, this country was designed specifically in opposition to theocracy to be a place where everyone can live and express their views.

“Our greatest colleges, were created By Christians”

And if our country had been over 95% hindu for most of it’s history then it’s greatest colleges would’ve been built by hindus.

“and laws were passed as early as 1690 for Literacy so that Children would be able to read the Bible and read the laws.  In fact there were inspectors sent to peoples houses, to make sure that the children in the household could read.  If they could not a twenty five dollar fine was placed on the family, alot of money in that day…”

Dollars weren’t even a unit of currency in the 1600s.

“Benjamin Rush warned educators that if we took the Bible out of our schools we would spend more time and energy on punishing crimes and less time on preventing them, because we would not be teaching our children the morals that are so instilled in our Bible the Morales that teach us right from wrong…How prophetic those words from nearly three centuries are today…  When we took prayer out of schools, violence sky rocketed, teen pregnancy hit all time highs, and many children fell down a darker path than ever before.”

The huge irony here is that there’s a direct correlation between a state being more religious and more socially conservative and having MORE pregnant teens. 

Religious highschools that preach abstinence also have higher rates of STDs and pregnancy then secular schools and we’ve seen less and less teen pregnancy in the last 10 years.  Not to mention the idea that all social change happens because of one court decision is ridiculous and has no logic to it.

So far as violent crimes many of the least violent countries with the lowest rates of war, terrorism, rape, robbery are the most secular, and countries like sweden and norway that are almost entirely made up of atheists have crime rates a fraction of those in the US which is 75% christian.  The homicide rate in the US is triple the homicide rate in sweden, and sweden is about 80% atheists.  The US has over 6 times as many murders as norway, which is 70% atheists.

“I am not saying we lived in a perfect society before, and many Christians embraced some very un Christ like ideals before and sadly many still do, but did you know that in the early days of our Country John Witherspoon trained African American Students at Princeton, something that was not so common in the days counting up to the revolution…”

Did you know christians enslaved africans for centuries because the bible says to this day that slavery is a god-given and totally acceptable practice?  You have very selective vision.  And many atheists like thomas paine led the rally for abolishing slavery, so do we get to teach your kids atheism in the schools as a reward?

“That Even Benjamin Franklin stated schools to educate African Americans, because they beleived that all people deserved an education, and they believed that the Bible should not be excluded from education, that is not to say it was the only text book in schools, but it was used, and it was used to help build the students character and morals…”

“When a religion is good, I conceive it will support itself; and when it does not support itself, and God does not take care to support it so that its professors are obliged to call for help of the civil power, ’tis a sign, I apprehend, of its being a bad one.”

– Benjamin Franklin

“The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason: The Morning Daylight appears plainer when you put out your Candle.”

– Benjamin Franklin

“I have found Christian dogma unintelligible. Early in life I absented myself from Christian assemblies.”

– Benjamin Franklin


“Michelle R Kidwell”

Mark aka agnophilo : )


About agnophilo

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16 Responses to RE: Our Educational Foundation Was Built On Christianity.

  1. FalconBridge says:

    I should move to Sweden or Norway.  Except that’s really really far away. 

  2. MangoWOW says:

    I always love blogs like this. I really hope they read it. 

  3. Casbahmaniac says:

    Good job. And fuck, this country is scary how far apart we really are. Monday on Maddow, JD Hayworth was on her show. He’s the guy running against John McCain in Arizona. She brought up his statement the days previous on a radio show regarding gay marriage in Massachusetts. He said that the language in the law says that marriage is defined as “get this, the establishment of intimacy” and went into slippery slope mode about how man would marry a horse or whatever. Well, Rachel had the law, read it and found no such phrasse as “establishment of intimacy” in it. She told him how she tried to find it, but nothing. This was undisputable FACT that something he said was not in the law. Well, he said “that is where we disagree then”. To which she then said…it’s not a debatable point. And this is the problem these days as I have said many times before. It doesn’t matter if you have facts, facts are argued as if they are just opinions.

  4. Bodhiseeker says:

    Funny you should mention about socially conservative areas with a high teen pregnancy rate. I knew this girl back in college and she hated me because I never read the bible (I grew up as a Hindu, btw). Since she found out that I am not a Christian, she would never stop telling me I would go to hell.By the end of the year she had to drop out of school.She got pregnant.

  5. merriej says:

    Exasperating! I don’t understand how someone who can write grammatical sentences and “seem” fairly intelligent can even BEGIN to argue what this person is arguing.Good job thoroughly deconstructing their “arguments,” point by point.

  6. Both Norway and Sweden have extensive welfare programs. Their populations are about 30 times less than that of the US. They spend less on militarization and more on education. Those could be some reasons for less crime and war too. I don’t know if the correlation is causation there. (also, the CIA world fact book says Sweden is 87% Lutheran, Norway is 85% church of Norway… I am confused by these numbers. The survey that said that 80% of Sweden identifies as atheist is by Grace Davie. I have not seen any other numbers even close to this. It seems to range from 10 – 30% atheist. Still significant to your argument, as it’s higher than the US, but Davie seems to have weird results.) I don’t believe war or crime has to do with religion. It usually has to do with who’s got money and power. Sometimes, often, religion gets used to sway people. But I think if most of the world were atheist, that would be used instead. People are ass hats.

  7. @FalconBridge – I just looked up some stats on Sweden. I am starting to really like what I see.

  8. Those are just facts…easily defeated by simply making some shit up, saying it and then beleiving it. (as usually the case when debating a conserv/christian).

  9. agnophilo says:

    @MangoWOW – Happy to please : )@Casbahmaniac – I know, it’s insane.  It frightens me that the young generation will be desensitized to bullshit and dishonesty the way we are to violence.  I don’t get how people can not be offended by overt attempts to manipulate them, at least once the attempt is underlined for them.I’ve debunked articles posted by many conservative bloggers who just keep going back to the same websites and “news” shows time after time to get the next batch of lies.@Bodhiseeker – To be fair anecdotal evidence doesn’t establish general truths, but it does show her to be a big hypocrite.  Of course she might’ve been projecting her guilt onto you or whatever messed up neurotic thing.@merriej – It’s psychological/emotional.  After I wrote this I checked out some of her other blogs, she openly pretty much says her friends betray her and people are mean to her, so she puts her energy into her “relationship” with god because he won’t betray her or be mean to her.  It’s sad : (  And no I don’t mean that in a mean way like pathetic.@MysticalInverseDrummer – Norway and sweden never had a revolution like the US where they started with a clean slate, they have official state churches that have been stripped of their power.  The church of norway is about as influential as the DMV, you need to be a member to get burial rights and other benefits, it’s an office of the government.  So like 70-80% are members, but church attendance is about 1%.  Same with sweden, polls show 80% don’t believe in any god of any religion, though some are deists, pantheists etc, atheists in the more general sense of the term, non-theists.  Think “church of england”.  Hope that helps : )And no, atheism is not an ideology.  Philosophies like communism is susceptible to that type of manipulation though.@tendollar4ways – Pretty much yeah.

  10. GodsGirl62 says:

    @Casbahmaniac – That’s the core of it “acts are argued as if they are just opinions.” No matter what religion, ideology or whatever you are, if what you’re saying is flat wrong, then you should shut up.I hate that people politicize school curriculum as if teaching kids what you wish were true is the best way to have a good society.

  11. agnophilo says:

    @GodsGirl62 – People politicize everything, even basic morality.  A guy got nailed for trying to bug a US senator’s office and CPAC (the big conservative conference where dick cheney, glenn beck and a bunch of congressmen were speakers) gave him an award for it.  He’s wanted for at least two felonies in two states, but he committed felonies against democrats so it’s not just okay, but praiseworthy.  Whether torture is moral or immoral is a right-left issue in this country.It’s disgusting.

  12. Bodhiseeker says:

    @agnophilo – No argument there. It was just an anecdote that came up as I read your post, especially when reading the part about the teen pregnancy and STD rates in areas where they teach abstinence education. It would be interesting to see if other countries have similar problems when it comes to religion and sex education, not just Christian ones. Either way, a great post, sir!

  13. agnophilo says:

    @Bodhiseeker – Thanks : )  And yeah I didn’t think you were trying to generalize, I just try to avoid/dispel generalizations because, well, they’re dickish : )  And yeah you might also find this blog I did ages ago interesting.

  14. asrial86 says:

    Awesome post.  Going to norway or sweden over the states ANY DAY.

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