Don’t get me wrong, I’m a big fan of parables, but only when they are food for thought, not rationalizations. Anyway, I read a blog where someone was talking about how their faith made them feel like they were constantly going in circles, and then one day their dog kept getting wrapped around a tree or pole or whatever and they kept having to walk them around in circles to untangle them and it occurred to them that this must be how god is with him and why god is leading him in circles and that he doesn’t understand the reason for it any more than the dog understands why he’s being lead in circles and that just like the dog being “set free” god is setting him free by leading him in circles…
Now this would be fine if it were food for thought, it’s an interesting “what if” idea. But he’s not using it that way, he’s stumbled on a purely hypothetical notion which, if it were true, would justify his beliefs and he’s decided it’s true – not because it makes sense, but because it gets him to the conclusion he believes he’s supposed to reach.
Anyway, I gave a response and I wasn’t going to post it but the guy ended up being a tool so I’m going to go ahead and post it.
I said:
You can use simple analogies like that to justify anything. You could’ve said “so by chaining my son up in my backyard until he’s thirty I’m really setting him free!”
Your religion isn’t working out for you but because being tied up doesn’t work out well for your dog that means your religion is working out for you?
Life is complicated and confusing, and we start out with no understanding of anything. And faith is no guide. It’s a compass that doesn’t point north, but points every direction in turn. Of course you’re going in circles. The reason the bible doesn’t help (or rather seems to help intermittently) is that the bible says everything. It espouses every opposing and conflicting ideology. God is kind and merciful and loving and he’s vengeful and jealous and spiteful and will fuck you up for the slightest thing. You’re saved by faith alone without the need for deeds of the law. Oh, and faith is worthless without deeds of the law. To not have faith is a terrible sin and you will and should be punished for it, so make sure you believe in god and heaven – oh and also nobody knows what happens when you die, to think you do is vanity, mankind has no advantages over the animals and so just live a good life.
The bible is a mass of conflicting ideologies, to “follow” it is like following a dozen people who are all telling you different things.
The solution is simple – USE YOUR BRAIN. Find out what’s good, true, useful, evident, logical and throw out the rest (1 Thessalonians 5:21). Because as we all know you should follow the newness of the spirit, not the oldness of the letter, for the letter killeth but the spirit giveth life (Romans 7:6). Oh, and while you’re at it all of scripture is universally true and useful (2 Timothy 3:16). And you should follow every letter of it until the end of time (Matthew 5:17-19). Except this part of course, that’s rubbish (Matthew 5:33, 38-39) and so on and so on and so on. I could go on like this for hours.
Start consciously choosing which parts make sense and rejecting the rest. You won’t feel like you’re walking in circles any more.
—
What was his response?
To the christian who commented:
“My brother, thank you for the visit, the comment and the rec! It’s been a privilege and a source of holy joy to watch you and your family grow in Christ over the years since you moved onto the block, and I thank God frequently for sending you to us. A man’s heart deviseth his way: but the LORD directeth his steps. (Pro 16:9)”
And to me:
“A fool hath no delight in understanding, but that his heart may discover itself. (Pro 18:2) LORD, how great are thy works! and thy thoughts are very deep. A brutish man knoweth not; neither doth a fool understand this. (Psa 92:5-6)”
His response is to be the ten thousandth christian to (literally) insult my intelligence by calling me a fool. I replied:
“And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.” (Matthew 5:22)
Like I said, I can go all day.
agnophilo 
Good points. I think we can surmise something from the circle running of his chained dog. His dog wants to get away to go bowling. 😛
The circle became interesting to me when i realized that the ratio of it’s circumference to it’s diameter was pi…once we realize that we can prove things, that is when things start to have a meaning…when we dont understand things we turn in circles so to speak….
It’s 5:40 on a Friday. I’m hungry and ready for happy hour. Is it a sign from God? Has God created my hunger and implanted my longing for a glass of wine as a way of telling me that there are a lot of conservative fuckwits on Xanga and I’m better off not reading their nonsense? I think it is!
I think there is more wisdom in God than you give credit. Very intelligent post. Truely. I do like locomotiv’s comment btw.The rationalization for the christian was not for his belief but “why would god let this or that happen?” The believer realizes that God knows better than he i.e. he knows better than his dog. Ever try to walk a dog in a circle to unwrap them from a pole? Usually not an easy thing. He used the circumstance to reinforce his belief that God knows best. Per belief and everyday circumstance, that could very well be true. It is not a rationalization to believe in God.If you follow a lot of the wisdom in the bible, you would typically live a pretty good life, as most of it is echoed in the professional psyche market. How interesting it originates from the time period that it does though. I am a christian…a loose one at best I suppose, agnostic might be a more accurate description. I do not dismiss science and I also do not dismiss that we are a bunch of idiots who know very little and are quick to jump at conclusions. IT is what it is. I find I “must tolerate” most “believers” and “non-believers” alike because they offer very little depth as far as the consideration of the opposing views/ideas/facts etc.Although not the best post, far above the average, very enjoyable, thank you for sharing!Like the play list as well!
Confirmation bias taken a step further, you make the circumstances which you then confirm. Sounds like Wall Street to me man. lol.
You would think a person could understand everything if explained in a proper way. Unfortunately there needs to be a foundation or groundwork for certain ideas to grow and be understood.First of all some folks are too competitive or impatient some people will come around but not now and some advance further than you can imagine. Hopefully we all can come to common ground and help each other at their pace and our pace.First priority everyone is to make a living for yourself. The second priority is to have a community that you enjoy being with. The third priority is to blog at xanga.Since being on xanga is low priority, yeah some comments will always be shallow. The deeper stuff on xanga may or may not come, it will take work and some common agreements with each other.If nuggets of wisdom get tossed out here on xanga, I am all over it. Applying nuggets of wisdom is a great thing to have.
I felt like you just needed someone to give you a strong rebuttal as to give you a little more kick to return to God. Good one, but I felt like you are just trying so hard to beat the strawman, but for what purpose?
It’s a good example of “truth is what you believe”. He thought it was so, and poof, there it was. I’m not saying he’s wrong, but that’s what he thought.
Being a fool is not all that bad, that mean who lack knowledge and wisdom.
Agno I don’t think you truly understand what the old testament meant when you see the word fool. The word fool in most of the old testament comes from the word baar which means brutish and is used, sometimes improperly, interchangeably with fool. Baar means a brutish man which is different from our modern conception of fool. In addition when the word kasal which does mean man of little understanding it is more akin to our conception of simple then fool. Fool in English means a person of little understanding, knowledge, wisdom, or intelligence. If you read through proverbs looking at every time it says the word fool you will find it is more akin to someone who is wicked because he does not understand that wickedness leads to death. In addition you have complained about several other passages that when taken out of context sound conflicting but when viewed in the whole list of concepts in the Bible makes sense. I will start with your last comment and work my way back to your first comment if you wish to follow along. Your last comment was taken out of context of even the verse that it was taken from lets see what the verse actually says in it’s entirety. But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘Youfool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.Matthew 5:22Jesus teaches that if you are angry with someone and do not forgive them you will go to hell even if you are a believer. We see this in the parable of the debtor:“Therefore, the kingdom of heaven is like a king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants.As he began the settlement, a man who owed him ten thousand bags of gold was brought to him.Since he was not able to pay, the master ordered that he and his wife and his children and all that he had be sold to repay the debt. “At this the servant fell on his knees before him. ‘Be patient with me,’ he begged, ‘and I will pay back everything.’The servant’s master took pity on him, canceled the debt and let him go.“But when that servant went out, he found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred silver coins.He grabbed him and began to choke him. ‘Pay back what you owe me!’ he demanded.“His fellow servant fell to his knees and begged him, ‘Be patient with me, and I will pay it back.’“But he refused. Instead, he went off and had the man thrown into prison until he could pay the debt. When the other servants saw what had happened, they were outraged and went and told their master everything that had happened. “Then the master called the servant in. ‘You wicked servant,’ he said, ‘I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to.Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?’In anger his master handed him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed.“This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother or sister from your heart.”Matthew 18:23-35When that verse is taken in context with this last verse especially in light of the new covenant it makes sense. Jesus said be holy as your heavenly Father is holy. If our heavenly Father forgives us we must not be unforgiving or bitter about anything. In addition you say that not having faith is a sin. The Bible does not teach this in fact what is says is that faith is advantageous to have as amazing supernatural things can happen when one has faith.The apostles said to the Lord, “Increase our faith!”He replied, “If you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to this mulberry tree, ‘Be uprooted and planted in the sea,’ and it will obey you.Luke 17:5-6 Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation.However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.Romans 4:4-5So the supernatural acts of miracles seen at various times in the church and the forgiveness of sins are both through faith.The next passage you quote is in James. Lets see what this passage says in context:What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food.If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it?In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.” Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds.James 2:14-18As we see in this passage deeds are a way of proving we have faith. This is logical because if you say you believe in something to help or benefit you, if you are telling the truth you should be willing to partake in what you believe in lest you be made out to be a liar. Such as the belief that a business venture will succeed if you really believe this your money and actions would be were your words are. You also say that the belief in God saves you. If this were true there would be a lot of demons in heaven. I do not know of a single passage that espouses anything other than either keep the whole law (an impossibility) or trust in Christ to obtain heaven. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.James 2:19For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.For he who said, “You shall not commit adultery,” also said, “You shall not murder.”If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker.James 2:10-11You also claim that love and jealousy and anger are incompatible let us see one of the many times that God claims these emotions.Do not worship any other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealousGod.Exodus 34:14Many times He uses this emotion to indicate His love for His children. It is for them to understand He doesn’t want them cheating on Him as they do multiple times in the Bible. From my own life if I came home to my wife having sex with another person or even kissing another person would I be angry and jealous? Yes I would. Does this mean I don’t love my wife? No not at all, my jealousy extends naturally from my longing for her love.